LED Dynamics Ultra-efficient Mini 1W 2-Cell LED Driver [Archive]

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 09:27 AM

New from LED Dynamics: the MicroPuck!
http://www.ledsupply.com/lib/ledsupply/micropuck-small.gif
The MicroPuck is a highly efficient LED driver, designed to power a single Luxeon 1W LED from two 1.5v cells. The MicroPuck provides maximum illumination to the LED while also maximizing battery life. As the batteries die, the MicroPuck drops its current consumption, allowing usable light to be produced long after an ordinary flashlight would be dead. Battery recovery (after the flashlight has been off) is also improved. The MicroPuck will still light the LED from as little as 0.8 volts. All in a package smaller than a dime.

Specs
<ul type="square"> Voltage Range: 0.8 - 3 VDC Efficiency: 85% Max, 70% Min, 80% Typ Current Output: 375mA, fixed[/list]Key Benefits<ul type="square"> Cost: The 2009 represents a low cost, small size option for providing current to LEDs with forward voltages in excess of the supply voltage. Voltage Following: The 2009's output follows the voltage of the batteries, but in a manner that provides more light during the midlife of the batteries. The unit can turn on with as little as 0.8V. Design ease: Ask about our matching array designs for use with this product. Safety: The unit is surrounded by insulative epoxy and is water resistant. The unit is short circuit and open circuit tolerant.[/list]The MicroPuck is currently available from LED Supply at
http://www.ledsupply.com
The MicroPuck datasheet is available at
http://www.ledsupply.com/lib/ledsupply/02009a.pdf

McGizmo

01-10-2003, 09:32 AM

Cool! Any more info? Pictures? Web page? Prices.............

Welcome to CPF! images/icons/grin.gif

- Don

Why wait; what is Vin range? Current control and level at the LED and all the other questions I forgot to ask?

sunspot

01-10-2003, 09:34 AM

Damn. I was reading about them this morning. They look nice but at $28 w/LS, it's a bit high.
http://www.ledsupply.com/kit001.html

Edit: I see they are on sale.

Calm down Don

McGizmo

01-10-2003, 09:48 AM

images/icons/tongue.gif

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 09:48 AM

Sorry, I was post happy and made the initial post before I had finished writing it images/icons/wink.gif The full post is up there now.

sunspot

01-10-2003, 09:51 AM

Can the Micro be had in a higher output, say 450-500ma?

Darell

01-10-2003, 09:58 AM

Pretty slick little self-contained unit, LED Dynamics. Thanks for sharing.

If the unit takes less current from the battery as the battery dies, does that simply mean that the puck is NOT regulated? Or does this only happen after there isn't enough juice left in the battery to maintain regulation (as in the BadBoy modules)?

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 10:11 AM

Can the Micro be had in a higher output, say 450-500ma?We are working on a higher-power model to drive 5W Luxeons. We hope to have it out soon. An announcement will be posted when it becomes available.

If the unit takes less current from the battery as the battery dies, does that simply mean that the puck is NOT regulated? Or does this only happen after there isn't enough juice left in the battery to maintain regulation?The MicroPuck is a regulated driver. It was specifically engineered to reduce current draw and light output as the batteries die, for two reasons. One, it extends the overall life of the batteries. Two, it gives the user a visual indication that the batteries are becoming weak. If the light output was 100% untill the batteries were totally dead and then the light just shut off, it could leave the user in a hazardous situation.

The MicroPuck is targeted specifically to flashlight applications. We are working on other MicroPuck and PowerPuck models with different operating characteristics, so stay tuned.

sunspot

01-10-2003, 10:23 AM

I was asking about higher output for 1w LS's. Mantra, "Brighter is better".
Do you have an output/time curve that you can post? I would like to see the fall off points.

Doug S

01-10-2003, 10:26 AM

Welcome to CPF Jeff.
I'll ask a few of the questions that the inquiring minds here will want answered.
1. Can you provide some graphical or tabular data of the LED drive current vs Vin?
2. Can you provide some graphical or tabular data of efficiency vs Vin.
3. Does the output side have some capacitive filtration or is the LED being powered by a series of current pulses where the average current is the nominal 375 mA?
4. The specified Vin max of 3.0 seems low. Can the device actually tolerate a Vin up to the LED Vf at 375mA or perhaps even one diode Vf above this?

Darell

01-10-2003, 12:53 PM

Originally posted by LED Dynamics:
The MicroPuck is a regulated driver. It was specifically engineered to reduce current draw and light output as the batteries die So "semi-regulated" then. Not fully regulated. The BadBoy, for example is effectively fully regulated. When regulation can no longer be maintained THEN the output neccessarily drops off, giving you plenty of time to replace the batteries.

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 01:25 PM

The device is intended to be powered from two 1.5v cells...
4 volts is perfectly safe. The device is not intended to be used with a higher voltage source and we don't recommend it, although off the record 5 and even 6 volts is probably okay.I have new information. Yes the DEVICE will tolerate voltages higher than 3v, but the LED may not. The device's current output will increase with voltage. Running a 1W Luxeon with a voltage source of greater than 3 volts will likely damage the LED. So our official word is thou shalt not use a voltage source of greater than 3v, or two fresh 1.5v cells. ALSO I should add that at this time we only reccomend running WHITE and BLUE Luxeons via a 3v source, as the other colors will draw too much current due to their lower Vf rating and may be damaged.

So "semi-regulated" then. Not fully regulated.You are correct, Sir. We decided to go for smaller size and lower cost, vs. full regulation.

Bear in mind, this is a bleeding edge product for us. We are working to improve the documentation and release more application notes which will detail other possible configurations, besides a 1W luxeon/3v source. We really appreciate your questions, so keep them coming images/icons/smile.gif

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 01:50 PM

Oh and please, don't only keep asking questions about the MicroPuck. If you have suggestions or requests for future version of the product, or other LED driver products, put them right to us.

B@rt

01-10-2003, 02:07 PM

Wow! exiting news!
Are you going to offer the micropuck as a stand alone product or just as a complete package?

Will you offer adjustable units?
At what specs are you going to drive the 5W?

Nerd

01-10-2003, 02:48 PM

Does these thing (Micropuck) produce any heat?
Needs to be sinked as well?
What about future higher power versions?
Any safety built in cut off for rechargable batteries?
Is there any plans to release a version with variable (read: user adjustable) cut off voltages and variable step up (and in this sense, like the mad max circuit in the sandwich shop by dat2zip)?
Any plans to release drivers for multiple LEDs?
Any plans to release drivers which can drive the 1 watt LED at 750 ma (maybe the 5 watt driver can do this?) Yeah, I know about the heat involve. Just as an option.
Any ways to make these into other shapes?
Any ways to make this as a battery drop in. Say, you know, the entire circuit can be dropped into the torch like a battery, and will regulate current?

images/icons/smile.gif

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 02:53 PM

Are you going to offer the micropuck as a stand alone product or just as a complete package?I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but I think you are asking if we will offer it in different packaging. We don't plan to at this time. The driver technology is available for licensing, and we can engineer it into custom solutions.

Will you offer adjustable units?It's possible, but we aren't planning to at this time. We will take your request under consideration.

At what specs are you going to drive the 5W?The 5W driver is still being developed, so no specs are available yet. But I can say that we are shooting to have it work with 3 to 6 1.5v cell sources, and of course it will drive the LED at full brightness images/icons/smile.gif

B@rt

01-10-2003, 02:58 PM

Thanks!

I should have been clearer(sp?) on my first question. What I meant was are you going to offer the "puck" without the Luxeon?
Sorry about the misunderstanding...

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 03:13 PM

Boy the questions just keep coming! images/icons/smile.gif I'll answer as many as I can.

Does these thing (Micropuck) produce any heat?
Needs to be sinked as well?It produces a trivial amount of heat compared to a 1W Luxeon images/icons/smile.gif The MicroPuck's efficiency is 80% typ, so it's power consumption is quite low. It doesn't require any heatsinking.

What about future higher power versions?It's really too early to say.

Any safety built in cut off for rechargable batteries?Not as such. At .8 volts the unit shuts off and current draw is only a trickle.

Any plans to release drivers for multiple LEDs?Yes, in fact the MicroPuck can do it. We are working on an application note describing how to use the MicroPuck to drive a string of 5mm LEDs. We'll post an announcement when it's ready. Future versions will also drive various LED configurations.

Any ways to make this as a battery drop in. Say, you know, the entire circuit can be dropped into the torch like a battery, and will regulate current?We are very close to releasing a drop-in replacement flashlight bulb featuring a 1W Luxeon LED and the MicroPuck driver technology. You can see a preview at http://www.ledsupply.com/ledflasbul.html
I don't know exactly when it will be available, but probably within a couple of months.

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 03:15 PM

What I meant was are you going to offer the "puck" without the Luxeon?Oh no problem. The MicroPuck is available right now as a standalone unit, at http://www.ledsupply.com/02009a.html

B@rt

01-10-2003, 03:45 PM

Ah ,thanks. Must have overlooked that... images/icons/blush.gif
(It's getting late here. images/icons/wink.gif )

tvodrd

01-10-2003, 06:06 PM

LED Dynamics- I just tried to order a couple of the kits and got a "can't find server" error during final checkout. Emailed you re from my POP address. Probably just a glitch. You gonna sell the "stars" seperately with bin info images/icons/grin.gif ?

EDIT: Ordered a couple this morning- no problems. images/icons/grin.gif

Larry

LEDdynamics

01-10-2003, 11:58 PM

1. Can you provide some graphical or tabular data of the LED drive current vs Vin?
2. Can you provide some graphical or tabular data of efficiency vs Vin.
3. Does the output side have some capacitive filtration or is the LED being powered by a series of current pulses were the average current is the nominal 375 mA?Phew, good questions images/icons/smile.gif I am honestly not sure, but I will ask our engineers if they can provide this information.

4. The specified Vin max of 3.0 seems low. Can the device actually tolerate a Vin up to the LED Vf at 375mA or perhaps even one diode Vf above this?The device is intended to be powered from two 1.5v cells, such as AA's, D's, etc. If you know batteries, you know that the real voltage of a fresh 1.5v alkaline cell is more like 2 volts. So yes, the device will tolerate voltages above 3 volts. 4 volts is perfectly safe. The device is not intended to be used with a higher voltage source and we don't recommend it, although off the record 5 and even 6 volts is probably okay.

LEDdynamics

01-11-2003, 09:23 PM

I've heard one or two comments from people who had trouble ordering, getting "can't find server" errors.

I checked with LED Supply, and they checked with Yahoo (their host), and no service outages have been reported. Probably just transient network glitches. If you have trouble ordering, please try again in a little while. Thanks.

Lux Luthor

01-13-2003, 04:45 PM

Originally posted by LED Dynamics:
Oh and please, don't only keep asking questions about the MicroPuck. If you have suggestions or requests for future version of the product, or other LED driver products, put them right to us.I would love to see one that has a dimming option for use in a 2AA headlamp.

evan9162

01-13-2003, 06:27 PM

Have you guys observed what happens when the puck is used with 3 cells (4.5V)? Does the output current increase? How much?

-Darin

Quickbeam

01-14-2003, 01:20 PM

So White LS's require additional heatsinking? Could you get away with the LS/o without additional heatsinking in a plastic flashlight using the micropuck? (say... 2xAA cells?)

Rothrandir

01-14-2003, 06:05 PM

you could get away with it for a while...but it will greatly shorten the life. specs say 350ma, so extra heatsinking, even if it is the mass of a quarter would help a little.

would i do it with no extra heatsinking...no

my stratagy for good heatsinking: if you can use a bigger heatsink...do it.

**DONOTDELETE**

01-14-2003, 08:43 PM

My first post so forgive me.
Pretend I work for a company that makes tiny drivers for LEDs.
Should I spend my time making exhaustive graphs or developing the higher power versions of the puck?

P.S. Do you want higher current 2 cell version or 3cell and 4cell versions first?
P.P.S. Don't tell my boss I was here.

Hemingray

01-14-2003, 11:29 PM

I bought several of these Micropucks. Works great on 2D cells and driving a 1 W white Luxeon LS/O
and another driving a royal blue LS/S. Initial current draw from fresh D cells is about 450 mA,
The Puck doesn't get very warm at all, and I added a TO-220 type heatsink to the LS/Os to give them about 3X more heatsink area, so they run warm
and not hot. Nice easy to use product, and it is small enough to fit in anywhere. I am working of fitting one and a white Luxeon Star into a 2AA
Ray-O-Vac swivel head flashlight.
Also another swivel head 2AA with red/orange "star and no puck. Fitting the optics in is a bit tight...

/ed brown

Tater Rocket

01-15-2003, 12:54 PM

I think what would be high on my list would be one that you can input any voltage in a certain range. Say any voltage between 2 and 7 volts would be great. Have it a buck/boost one and you'd make me happy. Kind of like the opalec or techass 10 LED thing where you can put about any voltage and it doesn't just waste the higher voltage, it just draws less current. Even if it were a bit larger I'd still be happy.

Spud

hank

01-15-2003, 03:32 PM

And if you could package them as flat disks that would drop into existing flashlights replacing the space taken up by the spring at the base, for instance -- in various diameters, since you'd want to contact the walls for heat dissipation.

PsycoBob[Q2]

01-23-2003, 10:49 PM

See what happens? Poor guy posts about his neat new product, and people immediately stuff him into a dark room, point bright lights at him, and ask difficult questions. images/icons/grin.gif

Remember what we want- It must be 1 mm3 or smaller, 100% efficient, run from 0.01v to 280v AC/DC, be completely adjustable (and connect to a wireless LAN for monitoring of Vin/Vout/Iin/Iout) and have complete graphs showing lab-tested relationships between Vin/Vout/Iin/Iout/Eff with 100 different sample 'pucks' to provide a good sample base.

Hank, putting a regulator at any place other than between the switch and the LED is a pain, electrically. Current-reg step-up units don't like being between the the batteries and the switch- they tend to blow up when they try to make the Vout high enough to stuff 350mA thru that open switch...

With it switch-reg-LED you have all the important connections available- ground, Vin, Vout, and LED-ground. The more of those you have, the more options/features available to the designer. With just Ground and LED-gnd (your idea) you basically have a resistor. No way to check output, so it's static. It IS possible to stick something in there- a LM317 adjustable regulator has a 1.5A built-in limit. I've used one set to 'max' voltage to overdrive a 5w LS, and had no problems. Cheap, inefficient, but it works, and doesn't kill the LED, or itself.

Hemingray

01-27-2003, 09:33 AM

This weekend, I set up a MicroPuck driving 16 green Nichia NSPW500Gs in parallel, seems to run just fine. I figured the 375 mA delivered current should be fine with 15 to 20 LEDs (and I just happened to have 16 left over from an earlier project). My LEDs seem to light up with equal brightness, but then these all came from the same
batch. YMMV...

This will end up inside (yet another) Ray-O-Vac 2D "Industrial" flashlite, soon.

Another one ended up inside a Luxeon Star upgraded Brinkmann "Rebel" LED light. Works just fine, here, as well. Nice simple easy to use product, I give the MicroPuck several "thumbs up".

/ed B in NH

Hemingray

01-28-2003, 09:05 AM

This was brought up elsewhere, but I'll ask the expert:

Seeing that a MicroPuck will operate to below 1 Volt, with a reduced LED brightness, can a 'puck
drive 6 or 8 white 5mm LEDs in paralell when powered with a single cell (1.5V) to a reasonable brightness. If the current to the LEDs was 120-150 mA, this should be feasable.

/ed B in NH

McGizmo

01-28-2003, 09:14 AM

Hemingray,

I too would like to hear the expert's response to this. In the mean time, I used a bench supply in the voltage range of a single cell and saw a current range of 85 mA down to 30 mA. My load was 9 nichias in parallel. I started cutting them out of the circuit, one at a time and saw no real fluctuation in current. This led me to the choice of 3 LED's; likely to be driven at spec in the range to be encountered with a single cell. I had hoped to be able to drive 7 LED's with a single AA battery but opted after testing to go for 3 LED's on a AAAA cell:

http://dmcleish.com/CPF/McTi/McTi-thumb.jpg

- Don

Doug S

01-28-2003, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by McGizmo:

I too would like to hear the expert's response to this. In the mean time, I used a bench supply in the voltage range of a single cell and saw a current range of 85 mA down to 30 mA.
- DonHey Don, you had the equipment and performed the test. That makes you the expert. graemlins/icon14.gif

McGizmo

01-28-2003, 09:46 AM

Doug S,

Tests should be performed by competent personel in a controled environment, or so I've heard. Well that puts me at 0 for 2. images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/tongue.gif

- Don

tvodrd

01-28-2003, 05:51 PM

The night before last, I hooked one up to an N cell. It put out a useful amount of light, but much less than on a 123. It was still making useful light 70 minutes later when I shut it off and went to bed. Last night, ran it another 85 minutes 'till bedtime. Output w/NX-05 held against it still exceeded my Arc AAA against the livingroom wall at 6'! Very interesting images/icons/smile.gif .
(So help me, I'm gonna kill that little N tonight images/icons/grin.gif .

Larry

James S

01-28-2003, 11:11 PM

I've had plenty of competent personel locked in controled environments tell me that things I do every day won't work images/icons/wink.gif

So thats not much of an indication. Whereas your flashlight actually lighting up there goes pretty far in convincing me that it works fine!

Josh

01-29-2003, 09:42 PM

Is it still kickin?

tvodrd

01-30-2003, 04:29 PM

Josh,

This is embarrassing! Not only did the Energiser Bunny win, but it is still winning! I'm up to 5 hours and 45 minutes. It goes back on later tonight. images/icons/grin.gif

Larry

Josh

01-31-2003, 05:02 PM

images/icons/shocked.gif , your never gonna get any graemlins/yellowsleep.gif graemlins/yellowsleep.gif graemlins/yellowsleep.gif images/icons/grin.gif

tvodrd

01-31-2003, 05:18 PM

Still emitting photons at 7 hours and 5 minutes!
(Edit) Should add that Vbat was .931V and Vls was 2.185V after 7 hours. Maybe I should enshrine it when it finally dies images/icons/grin.gif .
Larry

Hemingray

02-03-2003, 08:12 AM

From my weekend tests, 3 to 6 LEDs in parallel work fine on a 'puck and a single 1.5V cell
(I used a C just because I had one and a holder lying around doing nothing better at the time.
A single LED will emit that "angry blue" color,
and more than six really don't add anything.
I have a couple of left over 3-LED "bulbs" fro an earlier C Crane purchase, they work well here.

/ed B in NH

Josh

02-04-2003, 07:08 AM

Well now maybe you can get some ZZZZ's, that is if your baby will let you images/icons/grin.gif

ElektroLumens

02-04-2003, 03:51 PM

I've been using these Micropuck regtulators in the 2 C cell Luxeon Star mods I've been selling. Really works great. Gives reasonable light, for a very long time. About 12 hours of good bright light. images/icons/grin.gif

http://elektrolumens.com/ORACLE/Oracle._Regulated_1W.jpg

Here's a link to this flashlight I've been modifying with this regulator.

Micro Puck regulated 2C Luxeon Star Flashlight (http://elektrolumens.com/ORACLE/Oracle_Regulated_1W.html)

The Micropuck regulator is a very nice product.